Thinking of hiring a digital marketing agency or consultant? Learn the five questions to ask when vetting an individual so you can decide if you should hire a consultant or an employee or do it yourself.
If you’re a business owner or a marketing director, using these five questions will help you determine what’s best for your business.
IN THIS EPISODE YOU’LL LEARN:
- The five questions the experts use to make sure they’re working with the right person who can truly meet the needs of their businesses.
- Save money and skip the headache of hiring the wrong person by asking Questions 1 and 2.
- Know the full scope of your potential hire’s skills and if their asking price is fair.
- The question that will determine expectations and responsibilities before you start (« this will help eliminate miscommunication).
LINKS AND RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE:
Episode 117: The 3-Step Formula to 10X Your Facebook Ad Spend with Consistent ROI [Part 1 of 2]
Episode 118: How to 10X Your Facebook Ad Spend and Generate Consistent ROI [Part 2 of 2]
Episode 120: The “New” 5-Step Formula for Writing High Converting Ad Copy
Episode 121: How This Former L.A. Cop Built a Successful Facebook Ad Consulting Business
3 Injured After Small Plane Crash Near Enumclaw Airport
Dominate Web Media Real ROI
Certified Dominate Web Media Specialists
The Beginner’s Guide to Digital Marketing
Episode 122 Transcript (swipe the PDF version here):
| Keith Krance: | Hello and welcome to Episode 122 of Perpetual Traffic. Today’s episode, we’re going to really continue the conversation that we’ve had over the last few episodes and it started really back on Episode 117 where we had a two-part episode talking about the three-step formula to 10X your Facebook ads, with consistent ROI and a lot of cases 5 to 10X your business. We talked about specific case studies where we’ve helped clients do that either on the agency side or coaching clients. If you’re listening to this show, you might have listened to last week’s episode with Jason Smith about building a consulting business or an agency and you might be thinking, Men, should I hire somebody? Should I hire one of these certified consultants? Maybe I’m not at that level yet. Or should I learn the stuff myself and get really good at it, so I can be a better manager and a better leader and filter out the good from the bad? Or should I really train up somebody on my team? Or should I hire somebody to bring on my team to do this stuff? |
| If any of those questions are ever running through your head, I know how you feel. We’ve gone through this. We continually do, we get some of these questions so often from business owners and entrepreneurs out there and the thing is, is that I see a lot of people making a mistake in this area and they go and they get in a hurry almost and they’re like, “You know what, I’ve got to hire somebody because I’ve got to be working on my business instead of in my business.” So, they go out to Elance or Upwork and they quickly hire somebody to run their traffic campaigns or their digital marketing. Then they end up six months later spending 10,000, 20,000 or $50,000 with nothing to show for it. We’ve seen so many of these stories with our customers. | |
| On today’s episode, we’re going to actually give you five questions, five important questions you should think about and you should ask anybody that you are looking to potentially hire. Or you’re looking to maybe move from one position in your company to another. Think about these questions whether they’re something that you want to ask that person or if they’re somebody on your team that you want to train up and be that guy, think about these are the questions that they need to be able to answer, six months from now. If you’re looking for somebody to hire whether it’s an agency or a consultant, it’s not always about finding the best one or the most famous or supposedly who gets the best results or the most expensive. It’s about finding the one that fits with your business and your brand. Maybe it’s idealistically, maybe it’s price-wise at your point this time. There’s a lot of different reasons. But hopefully today’s content will help you. | |
| We’ve got Jason Smith joining us again. He was with us last episode. One of our recent graduates from our last certification event and he’ll be at our next certification event in Austin. Jason, thanks for coming on again dude, appreciate it. | |
| Jason Smith: | No problem, happy to be here again. Thanks a lot for having me on. |
| Keith Krance: | And Ralph and Molly with us again. How are you guys doing? |
| Molly Pittman: | Great. |
| Ralph Burns: | We’re doing great. Thanks for the intro there Keith. It hits the nail right on the head and quite honestly I think a lot of the folks that come to us as an agency and say, “Hey I want you guys to run our Facebook ads, aren’t quite ready. And we turn away a lot of people because of that because our mindset is that we want to train people and teach people and have them make the decision that is best for them and for their business. Just like you said. Sometimes that means doing it yourself, sometimes that means hiring somebody, sometimes that means hiring an internal resource. Sometimes it happens that way. |
| Like we had a customer just recently say, “Hey, it’s been great working with you guys for the last two years but I went and I got my own internal resource and I got to train them up and that’s what’s best for my business” I was like, “Great, that’s perfect.” I’m sorry to have them leave but the point is, is that, that’s what’s best for his business. So listen to this episode thinking, what’s best for me? It might be to hire an agency, it might be you do it yourself, it might be to get a consultant to do it. | |
| Molly Pittman: | Well and how to make sure you’re working with the right person that can really meet the needs of your business. Like Keith said, it’s not about gurus or who’s famous or all that crap. It’s about finding someone that has the skills and experience that really match what you’re trying to accomplish. |
| Keith Krance: | Absolutely and it’s all about where you are at this point in time. To piggyback on what Ralph was saying there and this is why we took so long to build out our coaching program at DWM, it’s because we don’t want to try to push somebody in one specific direction. We want them to be able to say, “Hey, you know what, we want to bring our ads internal. So how about if we, stay a part of your navigator, coaching program. Or we put our guy through your certification event.” Sometimes we have somebody that they say, “Hey, we want to hire you as an agency.” And I’ll be like, “No. You need to dig in for a little bit and get involved in this and see what really moves a needle. Maybe manage it yourself at this point. So when you are ready and maybe you are now, but you know what? Three months from now you’re going to be a lot better manager and leader when you really know what moves the needle and so you can hire the right person, put the right person on the bus to take your business to the next level.” |
| If you haven’t listened to Episode 121 last week, make sure you do that. Even if you are not a consultant, it will give you a good foundation, it will give you the perspective to see what can happen when you put somebody through the right training, be a part of the right community and what can happen with your business. | |
| So let’s get into question number one. Number one is, ask them how much experience they have. But not just general experience, ask them how much total experience and about the range of their experience. Have they worked with e-commerce businesses? Have they worked with digital product businesses? Are you a service based business? Or a local business? Or are you a Software as a Service? Maybe they haven’t worked with SaaS or software but they’ve work with something with a very similar sales funnel. So first of all inexperience can be costly. | |
| I was doing some research on Enumclaw Airport a few months ago, which is a small little tiny private airport right next to Enumclaw High School, which is where I went to high school, small town. Because my goal was to have a little amphibious airplane out here like Washington and be able to, 15, 20 minutes be in my hometown if I have to and stuff. I was researching it and I see this article, About Three Injured After a Small Plane Crash Near Enumclaw Airport. It crashed in a park right next to the play area where all the kids are playing. It’s like nosedive, we’ll put an image in the Show Notes for you. It’s pretty scary. | |
| Well, if you watch the video a little bit and you read the article, the plane was owned by a guy in the town next to it. He was a student pilot and his flight instructor was not with him. He was flying with him and his wife and another friend and he didn’t even have his private pilot’s license. So a student pilot is the same thing as getting your permit to drive a car, you got to have somebody that’s 16. Well a student pilot, you got to have a your flight instructor with you. And he just took off flying and got wrapped in a barbed wire fence and crashed nosedive into a park. Luckily it didn’t it hit any kids and kill them. | |
| The airline industry is interesting because if you want to even get an interview with let’s say, Alaska Airlines, you’ve got to have 3,000 total time in fixed wing or 1200 high performance military time. Then normally you have to have at least 750 hours as the captain, the left seat of a turboprop turbo jet. Delta Airlines is kind of the standard major airline minimums, which is 1500 hours total, a thousand hours fixed wing turboprop turbofan, which is a jet and minimum 50 hours of multi engine. And then typically you have to have even more than that to really be competitive. | |
| There’s a reason why a major airline won’t let somebody even if they have 800 hours just flying a single engine airplane even interview. It’s because you need that experience, you need that training plus experience. So think about this Facebook ads are the same way and that’s why in our certification, we try to do as many simulations as possible to get people that real life experience. But it still takes that. So just kind of think about that in general and if somebody doesn’t have any experience, that’s okay, it doesn’t mean that it won’t work. Especially because sometimes if you get somebody with a little less experience, it might be a better fete financially and then there’s somebody that goes out and does the work. And they’ve got the great training behind them. | |
| This kind of leads me to number two, which is where did you get your training? Where did you get your training? Do you have any certifications, apprenticeships, etc.? Have you gotten certified by any of the digital marketing certifications? Have you gone through a traditional university marketing program or somebody else’s training or certification program? So just take a look at that and think about that and then if it’s somebody on your team, where can you get them integrated as quickly as possible? So Jason leading up to our event, you were running some Facebook ads, for your MLM at the time and you weren’t actually going there to pivot your business, you ended up changing and becoming a consultant. But going there did you realize really what you didn’t know at the time. Sometimes we don’t know, we don’t know. Right? | |
| Jason Smith: | Yeah. I went to this certification, I had no clue what anybody was saying. I think the only person I really understood I think the second day was Molly when she came in and started talking, I was like, “Finally I can understand somebody, this is awesome information.” |
| Keith Krance: | Typical. |
| Molly Pittman: | A lot of our foreign customers are like, “You’re the only person I can understand.” Figured it’s ’cause talk slow.” |
| Jason Smith: | It’s Kentucky coming back. |
| Keith Krance: | What do you guys think on that? Looking out there, isn’t it true how many times we all don’t know, we don’t know. Or somebody that comes from Upwork maybe, they position themselves as an expert because they’ve gotten results for like one or two clients, right? |
| Molly Pittman: | I think it’s a great one. I also think obviously making sure this person has done this before. Unless you’re in the position … I mean I started as an intern with no experience and no education but if you’re wanting to develop someone in-house, that can happen but a lot of businesses don’t have time for that. |
| Keith Krance: | But it takes time yeah. You didn’t get hired to come in because you had a marketing degree to come in and do traffic for a DigitalMarketer, you came in with a group of interns. It was a long-term play. |
| So that leads me to number three, which is how many revamps? How many campaigns have you revamped? Resuscitated? Restored? | |
| Molly Pittman: | So good. |
| Keith Krance: | How many 68 Mustangs have you taken there just junk with a bad engine rusted out and turned into an amazing candy apple red, brand new motor, restored 68 Mustang? How many campaigns have you done that? Just ask them flat out. If they haven’t that’s okay. Maybe they’ve got the training and they’re willing to get the experience but then they should cost you less money right? And this question here for me really separates the men from the boys, the women from the girls. And how to look at a situation with a client, or a potential client and spot the low hanging fruit. Or spot the small hinge that swings big doors. When I used to do consulting calls and then that would to a client, a consulting or an agency client, I would never actually pitch anything or sell them or talk about my services. All I would do was get in and just started looking at their funnel. If they’re running ads, I’d look at those. If they were not running ads, then I would look at what’s their product they’re selling? Do they have a Lead Magnet? What is it? |
| Then I would just look at that and then I would start to give them suggestions. I couldn’t do this right away, I had to start getting that experience and I got better at it over time just like the team is doing that as well. Like Ralph when we used to do this together, it was never a sales call, it was just a teaching moment and then we would show them usually and we usually we’d find somewhere that we could make a quick improvement and usually it wasn’t targeting, it wasn’t bidding, it was none of that, it was typically revolved around their offer usually and sometimes their messaging, a lot of times their messaging as well. | |
| Ralph Burns: | Yeah for sure. And now we do this as ad account audit. Looking at one that just came in today, these people need a lot of help. We can probably help them pretty quickly just from changing that upfront facing head, you go for those easy wins. Usually that’s the difference between a winner and a loser on Facebook for sure. We would always give something of value and it was always, show people you can help them by actually helping them. We would do that on a call. We now have Adam that does all that and really does a great job at matching people who aren’t a good fit or ways that he can help them. He does an awesome job with that. I think you have to have some experience to be able to do that for sure. |
| Keith Krance: | And if somebody doesn’t have any case studies, right? Where they’ve done that. That’s not a deal breaker, sometimes it means that you might get a deal on a fee. And there’s nothing wrong with that. But you still want to start to ask them questions about some of the stuff. |
| Molly Pittman: | It’s kind of like the question that you get in job interviews that’s like, tell me about a time that you handled a disgruntled customer. That’s sort of what this question is, like what is your experience when things don’t work? A lot of the common sense and intuitive stuff we talked about in the last episode, making sure that you find someone who hasn’t just had a bunch of winners but someone that knows what to do when stuff just isn’t going the way that you planned. Because that’s how traffic works. |
| Keith Krance: | Exactly. Have you scaled up a campaign like we talked about on Episodes 117 and 118? Have you gone from 100 a day to 1,000 a day? |
| Jason Smith: | I think too. I’m kind of a good example of not having any experience. I had the right training when I left the certification and that first client kind of took a chance on me and we like 10Xed and stuff. It wasn’t because I didn’t have the right training, it was just I didn’t have the actual experience to be in there running his ads but that came very quickly because had the right training under my belt. |
| Keith Krance: | Yes. So glad you brought that up because, guess what now? You probably didn’t charge them what you would charge somebody else today right? |
| Jason Smith: | No. |
| Keith Krance: | Exactly same here. I talked about the Perry Marshall I think in the last episode. I didn’t even bill them, I was just running ads for free because I knew it would pay back down the road. Now if it’s a small business or something like that, if you’re a consultant listening to this, people that you got to charge them something right? But you got to get experience and more importantly case studies. So now he can talk about that how he took a client after 30 days and all of a sudden they’re spending 14,000 and generating almost 30,000. |
| Jason Smith: | They were spending like $2,000 a month, barely $2,000 and then we got them from there in 30 days up to that ads spend. They were freaking out. It was awesome. And I didn’t have the experience working on the platform as much, but I had the right training to be able to come in and say, I know what I need to implement, I just need to implement all these stuff and troubleshoot from there and then just scale up from there. And that’s exactly what I was taught. So we did. |
| Keith Krance: | Question number five will help tie this together a little bit especially with your situation Jason. Because the first two questions that I brought up … Wait a second, especially those of you that don’t have a lot of experience you’re like, “well, God I’m screwed. Thanks a lot Keith.” It doesn’t actually work that way. Like I said, there’s always a win-win scenario. It’s all about finding the right fit for your specific business at that specific time that we all develop into where we think we need an agency or a consultant. But maybe we should do it in-house at first or do it yourself at first and then grow to that. Or maybe we need to hire a consultant right now, we need the help. Then eventually maybe we want to have our internal team take that over. All that stuff can be developed over time and that’s what happen as businesses mature, they change their needs and that’s totally fine. |
| So let’s get into question four and five. Do they focus on the right numbers? When you’re talking to that person, what numbers are they talking about with their case studies if they have any. As a consultant one of the best ways to get a client is to go look through Upwork and see if somebody is posting a job to hire somebody, well you can go look up their website. This is what I used to do, is I’d go look up their website and find out what they’re doing wrong and then I’d send them a screen full of video. This is like 2010, “Hey, you should do this and your SEO will be better or your Facebook ads.” | |
| Let’s say that somebody does this to you, a consultant or you’re interviewing somebody and they’re talking about how much they grew their fan base and what their CPMs were and what their cost-per-clicks were and their CPRs and stuff like that. What numbers should these guys be talking about? This is a question for you guys, all three of you. | |
| Ralph Burns: | It’s very hard to identify that. But if you are a company, if they do show you their return on ads spent numbers, the first question I would say, for any business is that for cold traffic, you don’t even have to know anything about Facebook ads. Ask them that, first off what’s you cold traffic strategy? Great, retargeting DPAs, everything else is awesome. If you know how to do that, great, it’s going to be additive. But still it’s at the top of the funnel. Like how are you converting people to cold traffic, or at least indoctrinating them in. Super important question as a business owner to cold traffic. ‘Cause anybody can convert warm traffic. My son who knows nothing about Facebook ads could get on the platform and create conversions for a warm audience. But that would be a big question that I would ask for sure. |
| Keith Krance: | Are they focusing on ROI or website purchase value? Is it somebody that maybe comes from a branding experience and all they’re working on is just getting impressions and clicks and stuff like that. Then you got problem right? But maybe it is somebody that comes from a direct response background but they’re very good at smoking mirrors kind of like Ralph referenced there and they’re talking about these results of maybe a guru that they worked for during a launch that was only promoted to mostly all warm audiences. So you have to look, take the numbers in context. Was this person able to help this client go out and target cold audiences and turn cold unaware audiences into aware with intent and eventually customers? Can they do this? Even if they don’t have a case study specifically revolved around that, can they talk about it? Can they talk about the strategy they would use for your business? Ask them point blank, what would you do? What do you think? What would be a good message? So get them talking about the strategy. |
| So you can start to find out, are they only focused on getting cheap leads. Just purely curiosity based cheap leads where every lead that’s coming into your sales funnel or their client sales funnel is super skeptical. Because they’re doing the old school bait and switch or even just bait and just not real value and so nobody ends up buying very much. So they don’t make a lot of the profit. Think about that. | |
| And really the last one is, what’s the strategy scope? What I mean by that is where do your responsibilities as the consultant or agency end and ours begin. Is this person purely, all they’re going to do is they’re going to be just inside AdWords optimizing campaigns, bidding budgeting, split testing stuff like that? Or say, Facebook, YouTube whatever it is. Say Facebook, are they going to be in there, just focusing on running those ads and managing those campaigns and they’re just going to be, “Hey, I need some messages, I need an offer, I need a landing page and there’s no input there?” And that’s fine, that’s totally okay. A lot of people that’s what they do and they’re really good at it and you as a brand or marketing director or whatever your position is, you’re good at that, you’re able to create these things. | |
| But is it somebody that can give you some strategic advice, they can look at your sales funnel or your messaging and help you craft a much better message? Like Frannie talked about back on Episode 120. Is it somebody that can take a look at your funnel and say, “Yeah that $49 offer, maybe you should turn that DVD that you’re selling for $49 after they opt-in, you’re shipping it out. Maybe you should turn that into a Tripwire, a free plus shipping DVD and send it to them for seven bucks or 4.95 or 6.95. Is it somebody that can help you with those types of strategy? Now that’s a lot to ask. Now this is what we really help people with at our certification program that we talked about last week. This is something that we go deep into, and there’s a reason why. | |
| Ralph Burns: | I think it’s a higher level strategy of looking at things, which is what you were talking about before. It’s definitely something you want to have in anybody that you to hire, whether it’s us or you have an internal resource you have a consultant. You have to be able to sort of look at things from a 30,000 foot view and say, “Here’s where I would make some adjustments and some improvements or here’s where things are broken based upon what we see in the data.” I think that’s a really important thing as opposed to just sort of turning the knobs and pressing the buttons inside the platform. You have to be able to take a step back and look at things. I think that’s what the most successful consultants or ad agencies or anybody who runs ads internally for any platform is able to do in addition just the block and tackle stuff. |
| Keith Krance: | Then just being clear right? So if it’s somebody that’s maybe they say that’s not their scope so they don’t overcome it, but they do end up helping you on and that’s great right? But just make sure there’s clarity there and so you’re not expecting to have them be creating all your ads when you are the one that needs to be creating copy or maybe there’s a process where they have you go through exercises and then they create the ads or maybe you create some and then they create more split tests, more different variations to improve those or test against those. |
| So try to find out what that scope is and if you’re looking a training somebody in-house or hiring somebody to bring in-house. Think about how you can get that person trained up on and really communicating with the rest of your team. So you don’t want to look at your traffic person as purely only a traffic person because, maybe that’s what they’re focused on. But the more they can communicate with maybe the people that are doing the creative or building the website and optimizing. So, Molly, in your situation at DigitalMarketer, so when you’re working full-time in the offices, the VP of Marketing, how much communication was there between the different departments I guess? And how important was that? | |
| Molly Pittman: | I mean constant communication because traffic is the last step in marketing and I think it’s something that people forget they see dollar signs when they start talking about Facebook ads because they think they’re going to put in a dollar and make $5 back. Which is totally possible but it’s not going to happen with just a sales page for a product and a few ads. If you listen to the podcast you know that selling systems are important and that’s what we’re going to talk about on the next episode, the selling systems the DigitalMarketer has used over the years to achieve the results that they were looking for. But there’s so much more to traffic than just the ads or just the Facebook strategy. You have to have a good offer, you have to have good content. Tech has to build the funnel. Constant communication is needed when you’re running an operation at that scale. |
| Keith Krance: | Yeah 100%. Think about it so if you’re a business owner and you’re trying to train somebody in-house as your “traffic person”, you got to make sure that they understand that the important part is the people that are involved in creating those offers and that there’s constant communication. So, the person doing traffic can be like, “Hey, I don’t think this offer is converting because I’m seeing something here. Right? |
| Molly Pittman: | I think that’s why I was proficient in that position in running traffic, was I had a really holistic understanding of the Customer Journey. I knew how we were acquiring people, I knew what they were buying, I knew everything about the product, I knew the different promotions we were running via email to monetize those people. So, it’s really important for your traffic person whether they’re in-house, an agency or whatever to understand your entire Customer Journey. That way they’re bringing in the right people and they’re also running monetization campaigns for you like we talked about in the last episode. |
| Keith Krance: | Yeah, retargeting DPA ads and so if you’re going to go out and hire somebody, it’s a different story right? So you might not know the whole vast experience. So you want to ask these questions for them and find out, see how much they can be involved here and how much they can give truly legitimate feedback or advice to your team if needed. Or if you don’t have that team. Are they somebody that can go out and build landing pages for you or not? Sometimes you might need that. Just think about this and then just ask as many questions as you can with this person to make sure that they can truly help you build this machine. That’s what it is and if you build this machine right especially when you leverage Facebook, which is where the most people are, over two billion, it’s a great way to blow up all your other social platforms as well. Because you can siphon your followers from Facebook to become subscribers, to follow you on Twitter and Instagram and Snapchat etc. |
| First of all, what I would say is if I was going to hire somebody off the street and I owned any commerce store or I owned some software company or even a local business and I was to hire somebody or I was to maybe bring a niece that I knew that is just graduating college. What would I do? What I would do and I’m just going to be blatant honest here, this is what we do, this is what Ralph does with new team members at the agency, and you can add on to this if you want. Is we put them through our trainings and we have them take the DigitalMarketer certifications. So we have them go through some of the core digital marketing, sales funnel, sales customer selling systems like John is going to talk about next week. So stay tuned for that episode. | |
| Then we get them into our most in-depth. And if we have a certification coming up which I would highly recommend you going to or sending somebody to if you’re looking to train somebody in-house, which is going to be in Austin, November 30th through December 3rd. If you’re interested in learning more about that, go to dominatewebmedia.com/real-roi. So real ROI and you’ll either be taken to a webinar or Facebook live, depends if we’re still running the webinar or not. Or it will just take you directly to the main sales page, which is dominatewebmedia.com/getcertified. | |
| Let’s just do a quick recap of the five questions. If you’re a business owner or a marketing director and you’re looking to hire somebody, ask these questions. Right on Elance before you even interview them and if they can’t answer number one or two and they don’t have enough experience, that’s okay. ‘Cause if they’ve got good training, they can do the work, you can chat with them, it’s all about taking everything in the right context very, very important. Don’t just make quick decisions. | |
| Number one, how much experience do you have with that experience? Like what’s the total experience? And the range of experience? Number two. Where did you get your training? Online training, universities? Do you have certifications? Do you have direct response experience? Do you just have branding experience? Number three. Do you have any cases of revamps? Campaign resuscitations? If so, tell me about the results. Number four. What numbers should we be focusing on? Tell me what are the important numbers that you look at when you’re running Facebook ads or any type of page traffic. | |
| Number five, where does the scope end? Where does the strategy scope start and end? How involved do you get when it comes to some of the other overall strategy like messaging, landing page, product offerings? That type of stuff. Conversation optimization. Where does your scope end and ours begin? Is there any overlap? | |
| Those are the five questions. Lots other questions that you could ask but I think those ones there, if you start there, it will help you look at things from a different perspective and save a lot of money from hiring the wrong person. Putting the wrong person on the bus. | |
| Molly Pittman: | People always say hire slow and it sounds cliché but it’s really, really true and I think it’s something that Keith you and Ralph are really good at and whether it’s an agency or a person you’re hiring, in-house, whatever. Like I said in the beginning make sure that it’s a good fit in terms of the type of work and the outcome but also personality wise. And just making sure that whoever you’re working with is committed to serving the market that your business serves. |
| Keith Krance: | Absolutely. And we have a site, we will link to it at dominatewebmedia.com that we’ll re-highlight our recent graduates that have graduated, passed all the tests and everything. So anybody that comes to our next certification, even if you don’t have somebody that you would want to send to that, if you want to hire one of our proven consultants or if you want hire Dominate Web Media, either one, we can link out to that as well so you can see some of the folks and what they’ve done. |
| Other than that, we’ll wrap it up. Once again, the Show Notes are at digitalmarketer.com/podcast. This is Episode 122. Next week awesome stuff with John all about designing profitable selling systems. Thanks Jason. Awesome stuff, dude. | |
| Molly Pittman: | Thank you so much. |
| Keith Krance: | Epic. |
| Jason Smith: | Attaboy. |
| Molly Pittman: | Talk to you soon. |
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